ETA in NL wrong in the daytime — TomTom Community

Map quality

ETA in NL wrong in the daytime

iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
edited October 2020 in Map quality
This weekend we made two longer trips in the daytime in NL. The ETA's our GO 5100 gave were off quite a bit. Both times about 15 mins. This seems to be a problem when driving in the daytime when there's a blanket speed limit of 100 km/h in NL and the route planned is mainly on motorways that used to have a 120 or 130 km/h speed limit. Our GO 5100 does know all the speed limits.

It's very irritating to see the ETA creep up by a minute at the time during the journey and you arrive about 15 mins later than originally predicted.

Interestingly when you plan a trip on the My Drive Connect website you get a clear difference between day and night of about 15 mins for the trips we made this weekend.
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Comments

  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    Could anyone from TomTom have a look at my post? There really is a problem that needs to be solved.
  • VikramKVikramK Posts: 11,962 Moderator
    Hi @iMark
    Would you wish to share some information about the routes where you noticed this behaviour?
    Perhaps we can forward that to our team to test and see what improvements are needed.

    Thank you, Vikram


  • MarcAmerMarcAmer Posts: 1 [New Seeker]
    I have the same problem. For example the route from Amersfoort 3816Vz to Buinen 9528PM. Estimated time 1:38. Real time 1:59 with normal trafic.
  • Margot-JMargot-J Posts: 1 [New Seeker]
    I totally agree with the previous posts about the wrong calculation of the ETA during daytime. It has nothing to do with the route taken, and the tomtom shows the correct maximum speed, so there has to be something wrong in the calculation. That should not be too difficult I assume.
    It is the normal way of calculating the ETA when you know the maximum speed. This problem is existing for a couple of months now!! Can anyone from TOMTOM look at it? It is very annoying!!
    Or is this forum of discussions only for ventilating some grief?..... Thank you
  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    edited November 2020
    I had given up on anyone from TomTom actually looking into the problem.

    We had this problem back in August. We drove from Dutch postcode 1251 RE to 9922 PJ. Planning in our TomTom 5100 gives a journey time of 1u47 mins. The actual journey time was 2h03.

    What's really strange is that planning the journey on the TomTom website calculates according to the time of day. Here are two screenshots for the journey, one for departure at 20:00 and another one for leaving at 09:00.

    u8oa383jgt8g.png
    j6w59bmwlyh1.png

    I hope there will be fixed soon. The current situation is really annoying when driving longer journeys.

    You would think it's not so difficult to correct when there's a blanket speed limit of 100 km/h in a whole country.

    I would actually prefer to have correct data in the daytime and have early arrivals when driving between 19:00 and 07:00.
  • MegalosMegalos Posts: 6,059
    Superusers
    edited November 2020
    It's because TomTom does not use the speed limits to calculate routing and ETA. It uses IQ Routes data (which is historically recorded speed profiles). So real driven speeds instead of speed limits. But the issue is that this IQR data is an average over the last period, let's say half a year or so. So when suddenly speed limit change, it takes a long time for that IQR to 'catch up' with the new situation. That's why the IQR still thinks that during the day we can drive 120 or 130 km/h, while the speed limit is only 100 km/h. This results in wrong ETAs for this moment.

    This IQR data that is used on the online route planner might be more up to date than the one used in the PNDs.
  • eddydceddydc Posts: 145 [Sovereign Trailblazer]
    Hi,
    I had the same issue on Nov 11th. I looked the evening before and it calculated for my route approx 1h. I was in startled the next morning when I started my journey and it said that the same route would last 1h15 and I would thus be too late.
    Strange that it would miscalculate on a public holiday. If the IQR is to blame, it would a rather stupid algorithm when it doesn't take public holidays into account.
    When will this be fixed?
    Cheers,
    Eddy
  • MegalosMegalos Posts: 6,059
    Superusers
    As far as I know IQR is based on speed profiles for every 5 minutes for every day in the week. So indeed no special days are taken into account. It's all averaged.
  • eddydceddydc Posts: 145 [Sovereign Trailblazer]
    Megalos wrote: »
    As far as I know IQR is based on speed profiles for every 5 minutes for every day in the week. So indeed no special days are taken into account. It's all averaged.

    If that's indeed the case, one gets not only the incorrect ETA, but also the routes are not calculated correctly. I was already wondering why the app sent me in my way back via these alternative route saying that would be the fastest route. Since it was a public holiday, there were to delays/traffic jams at all, so the normal route would have suited very fine.
    Looking at the promo, it says "IQ Routes is the smart and efficient way to calculate routes ... This results in a faster route, and saves you money by significantly reducing travel time and fuel usage. ... whether you are traveling on a weekday or at the weekend."
    It doesn't seem to be that smart nor efficient and it doesn't travel time.
    Very disappointing.
  • MegalosMegalos Posts: 6,059
    Superusers
    edited November 2020
    Yeah, correct. When live probe data indicates that current flow is slower than IQR data (e.g. due to a traffic jam), that live data overrules the IQR. But it's not working the other way around: when live probe data indicates that current flow is faster than IQR data, it should also override that IQR data (this feature is not supported by TomTom). That would solve the kind of issues you mention.

    Perhaps a suggestion for improvement for TomTom ;)
  • YamFazManYamFazMan Posts: 19,481
    Superusers
    Hi
    I think we should, at the least, have a menu option to turn off IQ Routes like on the NAV3 devices....
    During the 1st Covid-19 shutdown here in the UK the roads were more or less deserted....
    On the days we did venture out... My GO 6200 was reporting ghost traffic queues....

    Stay Safe... ATB YFM
  • Test9Test9 Posts: 216 [Exalted Navigator]
    edited November 2020
    Maybe TomTom can do something similar about ETA

    Interesting news article, about Google and traffic in covid-19 times.

    "As we saw with COVID-19, unprecedented events can drastically disrupt traffic patterns and throw off prediction models. Google saw up to a 50 percent decrease in worldwide traffic when lockdowns started early this year. The sudden change forced Google Maps to be more agile. It began prioritizing historical traffic patterns from the last two to four weeks and deprioritizing older patterns."

    www.engadget.com/amp/google-maps-deep-mind-ai-accuracy-140005698.html
  • SteveFJRSteveFJR Posts: 2 [Apprentice Traveler]
    You have got to laugh at these posts, iMark made a comment on sept 11, VikramK from TomTom gave a reactie 13 days later and since then nothing from him or from TomTom. If I had the money I would ditch my 550 in the nearest canal and buy a Garmin XT. Whats going to happen is that TomTom will come with a new navigatie, claim its the best thing since sliced bread, and expect all 4xx and 5xx users to step over to the new system, instead of updating the systems they already have on the market. Talk about filling you pockets and then doing a runner................................
  • YamFazManYamFazMan Posts: 19,481
    Superusers
    edited November 2020
    Hi
    @SteveFJR
    I had a Ga*m*n once for a month :'( that was three weeks too long... I retuned it to the shop and exchanged it under their 30-Day Customer satisfaction guarantee.... I was fed-up with the weird routing poor traffic and garish screen....

    Stay Safe... ATB YFM
  • eddydceddydc Posts: 145 [Sovereign Trailblazer]
    I reported this to support. So far I got only the standard useless copy/paste reinstall answer.
  • fmesanderfmesander Posts: 0 [Apprentice Seeker]
    When will the incorrect calculation of the ETA in the Netherlands in the daytime be fixed? It is wrong since the speed limit during daytime became 100 km / hour.
  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    edited November 2020
    I'm downloading the new map of Europe at the moment. In the notes it says:
    8b7b3p8po8j2.png

    The penultimate point is really interesting. In order to prepare for your trips please download the new version of the map because it will calculate routes with new (ahem) speed limits in the daytime.

    The other thing that I don't understand is that TomTom doesn't fix this obvious flaw for a situation in their home country! I'm sure people working at TomTom in Amsterdam must have encountered this annoying bug.
  • MegalosMegalos Posts: 6,059
    Superusers
    iMark wrote: »
    The penultimate point is really interesting. In order to prepare for your trips please download the new version of the map because it will calculate routes with new (ahem) speed limits in the daytime.
    It doesn't say it will use the new speeds for route calculation. It will only use them for showing the speed limit (and warning if you speed). Since a long time TT has never used speed limits for route calculation or ETA predictions. It uses historic IQ Routes data instead.

  • Test9Test9 Posts: 216 [Exalted Navigator]
    Do they update IQ Routes with every new map version?
  • MegalosMegalos Posts: 6,059
    Superusers
    Test9 wrote: »
    Do they update IQ Routes with every new map version?
    Yes, indeed. But that also means it can be outdated a bit, and only updated every three months. So that would cause these kind of issues when a sudden change in speed limit is introduced.
  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    edited November 2020
    I would actually like to hear from TomTom if there will be a solution to this annoying problem.

    My suggestion is to do the calculations the other way round. Do them based on the 100km/h speed limit with correct ETA's in the daytime.

    For travel at night you would then get ETA's that would give you early arrivals. Much less of a problem than late arrivals in the daytime.
  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    It seems that the issue has been solved. Over the last couple of weeks I've made several trips in the daytime when the 100km/h speed limit is in force on roads with 120 or 130 km/h speed limits at other times.

    On all three trips the ETAs were pretty accurate while driving at 100km/h. I don't know what has been fixed but it's definitely working properly again.

    Still disappointing that nobody from TomTom ever replied in this thread since @VikramK 's comment on 24 September. That's now almost three months ago.
  • YamFazManYamFazMan Posts: 19,481
    Superusers
    edited December 2020
    Hi
    I guess, as stated several times above....
    The IQ route data, simply caught up with reality....

    Stay Safe... ATB YFM
  • iMarkiMark Posts: 13 [Master Explorer]
    Someone from TomTom could have explained this.
  • eddydceddydc Posts: 145 [Sovereign Trailblazer]
    YamFazMan wrote: »
    Hi
    The IQ route data simply caught up with reality....

    Is that also the case with eg public holiday and routes will be calculated on reality instead of IQ routes thinking that it isn't a public holiday?

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