Condensation Screen RIDER 400 - Page 4 — TomTom Community

Condensation Screen RIDER 400

124

Comments

  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    Consumer law in the UK probably the EU gives us the right to sue for upto 6 years. You are supplying goods with a known fault from the factory which means they are not fit for purpose! That does not entitle tomtom to change any warranty terms to 6 months!
  • 954dk954dk Posts: 292 [Master Traveler]
    Mikkok:
    I would advice you to read the EU regulations/law about gaurantees and returns - also covering replaced, partial replaced and repaired devices.
    I'm speaking of private EU consumers/citizens.

    I live in Denmark.
    If you e.g. repair a power off button on my device, you are obligated to give me a 5 year warranty on the repaired button.
    If you replace my screen the warranty/guarantee on the screen is 2 years from time of delivery.
    If you "reseal" the screen, there is a 5 year guarantee.

    Off course there is a "hierarchy of remedies":

    Firstly, repair or replacement according to the consumer's wishes, within a reasonable time and free of charge
    Secondly, refund or reduction of the purchase price if repair or replacement are not possible within a reasonable time frame.

    As "advanced.riders" wrote:
    ...You are supplying goods with a known fault... :?
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    Hi advanced.riders

    This is Vikram the moderator on the English community.

    I would request you to please send me the incident number in which the customer service wrongly informed you about the device warranty.

    I will wait for your reply

    Thanks and regards
    Vikram

    Sorry Vikram, but I think you need to read about the UK 'Consumer Rights Act 2015' and also Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act - If you buy goods or services on your credit or debit card, you could have extra protection if things go wrong. This is because Section 75 gives you rights to claim against your provider.

    You are mistaken if you believe faulty goods that have been replaced are somehow subject to a lesser warranty! I would appreciate it if you wish to contact me then you can find me here - not on a private message.
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    Just to make everyone aware, some of my comments have been removed by a moderator as I have quoted PM'd messages between TomTom and myself.

    I will make an official complaint with TomTom regarding the miss information being provided to customers, that ignore UK and EU consumer protection laws which is there for our protection.
  • MikkoKMikkoK Posts: 23,905 Retired Community Managers and Staff
    Hi all,

    Thanks for your feedback!

    I've discussed this with the product as well as our legal team and got the following information to share with you:

    We have in the past seen more returns due to condensation than usual. We’ve since taken measures regarding this and now see declining numbers of returns due to this issue. Customer Service is up to speed about this and prepared to make warranty exceptions to deal with this issue.

    As I explained here earlier, our repairs/replacements have a 6 month warranty. However, this doesn't replace the existing manufacturer warranty, starting when you purchase your device, but both warranties run simultaneously. For instance, If you have a repair done within the last three months of the warranty, the warranty on the repair will effectively add an additional 3 months when the original manufacturer’s warranty expires. However, if you have a repair and you’re more than 6 months away from the end of the manufacturer’s warranty, then you will only have a warranty until the end of the original manufacturer warranty.

    The consumer laws and regulations mentioned here do not relate to the right of a customer to receive warranty, but a right to bring a claim to a manufacturer/seller if they believe the product does not comply to the contract of sale.

    Cheers, Mikko
  • 954dk954dk Posts: 292 [Master Traveler]
    I respect you, but you will have to follow the EU legislation laws.
    I'm excited to see, how you will succeed in the above.

    I think it's better than arguing with you on a customer support- and feed-back forum :-D

    No matter what, I think you'll loose many existing and also potential new customers.

    Cheers!
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    I've spoken to Tomtom UK customer service and raised a complaint regarding this forum and the misinformation being offered. Agent was extremely helpful, professional and has confirmed my case has been escalated again.

    It has also been confirmed that a 2 year warranty applies in the UK - sorry can't advise about EU. I'll let you guys know later what is happening.

    I must say that the moderators on here do nothing to help this issue, arguing about warranty lengths, all extremely unprofessional !! to be clear TomTom are aware of the problem, some units are clearly being supplied faulty as are replacement units.

    I still prefer the Rider 410/450 for its routing options and screen clarity (when its not fogged up) over Garmin, I've ridden with Garmin 550, 660, 590 and BMW Nav V(Garmin) plus many 410 and one 450 Rider. I honestly don't believe TomTom would NOT be prepared to help any buyer whether in warranty or not when it comes to the condensation problem. So if you have the issue make the call to customer service and remind them gently that its a known issue, they are supplied from the factory faulty and a free replacement is required.

    I'll update later when I know more
    /Paul L
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    Hi MikkoK (and fellow consumers 954dk & advanced.riders)

    Mikko, I got the following from Customer Service today, so I will try the software update in the event that is all that is wrong (although I have, sadly, read other threads on here about issues following upgrades - however, I do work in software and understand that the upgrade could solve things). If it does not help, I would appreciate you helping in regards to your comment "prepared to make warranty exceptions to deal with this issue"

    I'm off to do the software upgrade. Wish me luck!!!!!



    Dear ,

    Thank you for contacting TomTom Customer Support. My name is Vxxxx, and I will be assisting you today.

    The reference number for your query is .

    I understand from your email that when you try to select anything on the perimeter of the screen, nothing happens. Your device is not responding, the centre of the screen is OK.

    I apologize for the inconvenience which may have caused.

    I’m glad that you emailed us and I will take care of this immediately.
    It can either be software issue or a hardware issue. Just to narrow down the possibilities, I would suggest you to connect the device to the computer and update the software on your device (as your software/application is outdated v17.102).
    Please follow the link below which will help you to update the software on your device.
    How do I update the software on my device?

    If the issue persists, we can book repair for your device. To book a repair I would need following information:
    1. Copy Of receipt of Purchase (Please note : Repair/replacement fees of €105 will be applicable if the device is out of warranty)

    Devices which are purchased after 29/04/2015 has a warranty period of 2 years.
    2. Confirm the serial number of your device.
    Where to find the serial number can vary per model. For information on where to locate the serial number, please refer to the images in our FAQ: https://uk.support.tomtom.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/9508/. It usually begins with 'C_No' or 'S/N' followed by one or two letters and a series of nine or ten more digits. For example, 'V12345A67890' or 'RB12345I67890'.
    3. Complete address with the post code.
    4. The Contact number?`
    5. Detail information regarding the issue which will be helpful for the repair department to get the device repaired.
    I look forward to hearing from you.

    If you need further assistance or have any more queries, please feel free to call us on 02079490134 or simply reply to this e-mail and we will be more than happy to help.

    Our working hours are 9:00 am to 5:30 pm, Monday through Friday.

    With Best regards,

    TomTom Customer Support
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    Glad they have now confirmed a 2 year warranty to both of us, something that non of the forum moderators chose to mention
    /Paul L
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    Glad they have now confirmed a 2 year warranty to both of us, something that non of the forum moderators chose to mention
    /Paul L

    Hi Paul,
    I did actually find this on the tom-tom FAQs - hence why I originally wrote I was just two months out of warranty....so I might have helped had I stated that clearly ;)
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    MikkoK wrote:
    Hi all,

    Thanks for your feedback!

    I've discussed this with the product as well as our legal team and got the following information to share with you:

    We have in the past seen more returns due to condensation than usual. We’ve since taken measures regarding this and now see declining numbers of returns due to this issue. Customer Service is up to speed about this and prepared to make warranty exceptions to deal with this issue.

    As I explained here earlier, our repairs/replacements have a 6 month warranty. However, this doesn't replace the existing manufacturer warranty, starting when you purchase your device, but both warranties run simultaneously. For instance, If you have a repair done within the last three months of the warranty, the warranty on the repair will effectively add an additional 3 months when the original manufacturer’s warranty expires. However, if you have a repair and you’re more than 6 months away from the end of the manufacturer’s warranty, then you will only have a warranty until the end of the original manufacturer warranty.

    The consumer laws and regulations mentioned here do not relate to the right of a customer to receive warranty, but a right to bring a claim to a manufacturer/seller if they believe the product does not comply to the contract of sale.

    Cheers, Mikko


    Hi MikkoK
    Are you able to help me with this given I have now updated the software as Customer Services told me to, but to no avail - screen is still not touch responsive?
    I can give you the case number if that will help.
    Thank you
    Caroline
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    Ducati749 wrote:
    MikkoK wrote:
    Hi all,

    Hi MikkoK
    Are you able to help me with this given I have now updated the software as Customer Services told me to, but to no avail - screen is still not touch responsive?
    I can give you the case number if that will help.
    Thank you
    Caroline

    The first unit failure I had with the condensation issue eventually affected the touch screen and also the landscape/portrait mode went a bit crazy. You may do better escalating your case to a supervisor/manager with TomTom customer service.
    I was offered a free upgrade yesterday to a Rider 450, I had to advise them I had already been upgraded.

    The screen is very sensitive on the new 450 especially if you wear gloves

    /Paul
  • RTwoRTwo Posts: 53 [Master Traveler]
    The replacement 400 I got from Halfords (in the UK) in the Spring has now succumbed to the condensation issue.
    It had been fine up until my return from a tour in Spain.
    There was a couple of days of torrential rain and I'm guessing that was the point at which some moisture entered the unit.

    My plan is to see how it behaves for the rest of this year and look to get Halfords to replace it again next if it doesn't clear up.
  • advanced.ridersadvanced.riders Posts: 15 [Apprentice Seeker]
    We're off to Spain etc in a couple of weeks, I expect condensation behind the screen, I doubt it's rain, the unit is waterproof. All mine fail when there is a heat or altitude differential. 24C in the UK and my latest Rider 450 failed.
  • RTwoRTwo Posts: 53 [Master Traveler]
    Oh, we had plenty of heat and altitude differences as well as rain (and snow)
    4C-36C / sea level-2000m
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    Spoke to Customer Services yesterday (as some questions I was asking via the support case were not being answered fully). The lady was very helpful and confirmed if there is Condensation, the unit will be replaced even though out of warranty by two months.
    Sadly, going by this forum, I suspect that I may get a unit which already had the Condensation complaint, but....what can you do? I don't intend going abroad next year, but if I get the Condensation again after another trip, I am just going to insist on it being replaced again.
    Anyway, off to pop it into a UPS pickup point and hope for the best!!
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    RTwo wrote:
    Oh, we had plenty of heat and altitude differences as well as rain (and snow)
    4C-36C / sea level-2000m

    RTwo - I'd try to get it replaced if I were you. Rather than wait.
  • RTwoRTwo Posts: 53 [Master Traveler]
    Ducati749 wrote:
    RTwo wrote:
    Oh, we had plenty of heat and altitude differences as well as rain (and snow)
    4C-36C / sea level-2000m

    RTwo - I'd try to get it replaced if I were you. Rather than wait.

    I will do but I'm fairly relaxed as to when
    Halfords will replace it without quibble, maybe worth waiting and getting a newer model as a replacement when they run out of stock of 400s
  • Paul.R.F.Paul.R.F. Posts: 99 [Apprentice Traveler]
    I took my Rider 400 out again and got the condensation problem for the second time in a row. I have had this unit for approx. 10 mths and it has never down it previously but a couple of months ago I did use it when it was wet. It was not heavy rain just a very light shower. I face the decision if it is worth taken in for repairs as most of the comments here suggest that either having a repair or getting the unit replaced does not mean you end up with a unit that will not get condensation. Wished I had come to this forum first and read about the problems before purchasing this product.
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    Paul.R.F. wrote:
    I took my Rider 400 out again and got the condensation problem for the second time in a row. I have had this unit for approx. 10 mths and it has never down it previously but a couple of months ago I did use it when it was wet. It was not heavy rain just a very light shower. I face the decision if it is worth taken in for repairs as most of the comments here suggest that either having a repair or getting the unit replaced does not mean you end up with a unit that will not get condensation. Wished I had come to this forum first and read about the problems before purchasing this product.

    To be fair Paul, it does look like tomtom will replace it, as they recognise it is an issue - and they probably shipped many many untits before they knew......and perhaps a few after (who knows!), but given I was 2 months out of warranty, they've been very customer-friendly with me thus far. I like tomtom way more than Garmins and a few others that fellow riders have, so don't really want to change. I got mine not long after the 400 was launched, so there probably weren't comments like this to read. I'm giving tomtom the benefit of the doubt to 'make good' on something that has gone wrong in their manufacturing process.
  • Paul.R.F.Paul.R.F. Posts: 99 [Apprentice Traveler]
    Ducati749 wrote:
    Paul.R.F. wrote:
    I took my Rider 400 out again and got the condensation problem for the second time in a row. I have had this unit for approx. 10 mths and it has never down it previously but a couple of months ago I did use it when it was wet. It was not heavy rain just a very light shower. I face the decision if it is worth taken in for repairs as most of the comments here suggest that either having a repair or getting the unit replaced does not mean you end up with a unit that will not get condensation. Wished I had come to this forum first and read about the problems before purchasing this product.

    To be fair Paul, it does look like tomtom will replace it, as they recognise it is an issue - and they probably shipped many many untits before they knew......and perhaps a few after (who knows!), but given I was 2 months out of warranty, they've been very customer-friendly with me thus far. I like tomtom way more than Garmins and a few others that fellow riders have, so don't really want to change. I got mine not long after the 400 was launched, so there probably weren't comments like this to read. I'm giving tomtom the benefit of the doubt to 'make good' on something that has gone wrong in their manufacturing process.

    Spoke to Tom Tom customer service in Australia and was told to send it in for repairs and to them it is not a known issue. Also spoke to Consumer Affairs and their advice was to send it in and if the problem reoccurs then I have the right to take them to a small claims court to get a refund.
  • McbridMcbrid Posts: 4 [Novice Seeker]
    Is the touch screen getting really hot when this happens?

    Reason I ask is mine started showing condensation inside and it was really too hot to touch. Although it was never confirmed after I returned the unit to Tom Tom it was at the same time as the dock was giving charging issues (that's a whole other subject though)

    Just wonder if the dock is giving too much voltage which shows when the ambient temp is hot as well?
  • Paul.R.F.Paul.R.F. Posts: 99 [Apprentice Traveler]
    Mine did not get hot. Wasn't a very warm day either.
  • Paul.R.F.Paul.R.F. Posts: 99 [Apprentice Traveler]
    Received a replacement yesterday and after loading updates and maps as well as changing the settings I went for a ride to a motorbike shop today that is 25 kms away and all was good but 5 minutes into the ride home and I got condensation, worse than my original Rider. Going to go for a refund.
  • Ducati749Ducati749 Posts: 10 [Novice Seeker]
    Just a wee update - I received my tomtom back recently (my own unit - same serial number and same wee dent on it that happened the day I brought it home!!). It worked perfectly on the two trips I have been on - one of which rained buckets on way to Rothesay, scorcher of a day next, and then rained ten times more buckets on the way home.....no condensation. So, as good as I could expect for now.
    I'm glad they fixed it at no charge....at least that gives me faith in them as a brand. Things can go wrong, and it's how they handle it that makes them a market leader. So I am happy for now. Just a bit sceptical of whether it will happen again....but life is too short to be expecting the worst isn't it :)
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